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Welcome to the well.
At the well we meet Finnish spiritual adults
with everybody three times.
Now we have a second meeting with Reverend Kalevi Lehtinen.
Kalevi Lehtinen is the teacher of God's word.
He is one of the most well known speakers in Finland.
Also known in the other parts of the world especially in Russia,
Estonia and evy countries.
Welcome to the well Kalevi Lehtinen. - Thank you.
When I look at you, listen your teachings,
read your books; the word radical comes to my mind.
I thought we could talk about that.
Young people are generally radicals.
It's part of their world.
You are 70 and you are still a radical. Why?
I think that is the most sensible way to live a Christian life;
to live completely for Jesus.
If you try to live just minimum, you barely cross over the line
in order to get the heaven. That is not life.
But if you want to live maximum for Jesus, you'll find an excitement.
You are not only a spender but you are an investor.
You live in adventures.
If you live minimum Christianity
then you have just minimum from the Lord.
If you live maximum Christianity The Lord gives you a lot.
Life becomes rich.
What has happened in your life that
makes you still enthusiastic about Christ.
I believe when you live with Christ it is not any kind of theoretical and
philosophic doctrine but a love relationship with Jesus.
It is the same between a man and a woman
who over the decades grow together
in order to love each other more clearly.
It's the same with Jesus;
the relationship changes and renews if we live it fully.
The happiness is not going to diminish.
I think this is an important attitude if we live like this.
During our last program we talked about you becoming free of
the order of deeds and law.
And you got into the order of grace.
What have you done yourself or have you done anything?
I have not done anything by myself.
But I want to have a happy relationship with Jesus,
it follows from that.
I seriously listen what Jesus says in the Bible.
What Paul writes and what the Holy Spirit says.
God works here and now.
The book of Acts in the Bible describes the Christian life.
It is like a guerrilla movement spreading to all over the world;
going forward by means of every member of that unit
telling about Jesus.
It does not grow through pastors
but with the company which has passion for Jesus.
And we should return to that principle.
Why some people burn like fireworks for awhile
then their spiritual life dies down?
Can you answer for this difficult question?
No I can't. There are as many reasons as one legion.
It starts when a romance with Jesus disappears.
It becomes routine
It's like a marriage which is not happy any more.
You just stay there but it doesn't motivate you.
When a spark is lost there are consequences.
Other things becomes greater value.
People may escape to different things; adventures, drugs, sex.
They try to find a compensation.
The most important thing in life is not the most important.
When you talked about the Christian life according the book of Acts.
At that time the Holy Spirit was poured down.
You are also the man who talks about the Holy Spirit. Why?
Right at this time Jesus is sitting on the right hand side of the Father.
He has all the power in heaven and on the earth.
He sits on the place of a Majesty,
but he is present as the Holy Spirit.
As a matter of fact it is more meaningful for us than
if He would be here as a physical person.
As a physical person He is bound with time place and substance.
He can't be at the same time in Jerusalem, Damascus,
Antioch Athena, Berlin, Helsinki and TV7.
But as a form of the Holy Spirit
He can be at the same time in Jerusalem, Damascus,
Antioch, Athena, Berlin, In Helsinki and here with us.
It is important to realize when Jesus said;
“it is better for them when I leave you because
if I do not leave you then the Defender
the Holy Spirit can't come and stay with you.”
What kind of purpose the Holy Spirit gives to an ordinary Christian?
Nobody can be a child of Jesus without the Holy Spirit.
When the Holy Spirit comes He will give birth to faith.
When we receive Jesus;
He stands at the door and knocks;
accurately said there is
the Holy Spirit who stands at the door and knocks.
As a matter of fact when we receive Jesus, He is not here.
Why do we then say Jesus!
The Holy Spirit does not glorify Himself but
He glorifies Jesus like the Bible says.
It's easier for us to understand Jesus because
He has been a human.
Then it is easier to talk about receiving Jesus.
Talking about the work between the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit;
this is the work of the Holy Spirit.
What does the Holy Spirit mean in your life?
It started when I had been a Christian only for a couple months.
I had learned that there is 2 different kind of Christianity.
One that I had; could be described as “devout misery”
or “passed away as a young.”
The second one was the Christianity described
in the book of Acts. I realized I was lacking that.
At that time I was doing my summer job at the post office in Kerava.
One day I was talking with a night watchman named Moilanen.
I explained him about my situation. He said:
”Kalevi you should be filled with the Holy Spirit.”
I asked what should I do?
That was a first time I became conscious about that.
From that started a long process between different views.
Then I understood I could receive the Holy Spirit by faith
without extraordinary experiences.
The Holy Spirit is responsible what happens in my life.
Some will have fireworks others will have tears
others will get gift of grace; different tasks.
The Holy Spirit is a person.
It means that He works consciously and can meet a person individually.
He respects the work that God has done.
He doesn't fight against God's creation.
He doesn't change us.
Many people are afraid when the Holy Spirit fills them;
they become gigglers.
The Bible says that the Holy Spirit is
the Spirit of power, love, and healthy consideration.
The Holy Spirit can be experienced everyday
much more than Christian meetings show.
In what way you could be filled with the Holy Spirit
if you twist it with iron wire?
It is a very simple thing. In the Bible there is a command:
let the Spirit fill you. It is written Ephesians 5:18.
It is the will of God that we will be filled with the Holy Spirit.
The promise of the Bible says that
we can courageously approach God believing that
He will give us what we ask according to His will.
When we ask so we know He will listen us.
And when we know that He listens us
so we know that we will get what we ask.
Now when I courageously approach God and
ask that He fill me with the Holy Spirit.
Right away a question comes to my mind
how do I know this is the will of God.
I know because He commands me to be filled with the Holy Spirit.
When I pray and when I pray according to His will
He will listen and I know and I can own by faith what I ask.
There does not have to be experiences and feelings
but to accept God's authority.
Then later you will get experiences, people get different experiences.
A conclusive thing is that the Holy Spirit takes over our lives.
When you have given your life to the Holy Spirit and
been filled with the Holy Spirit.
What kind of life you have had?
It has been an adventure;
lots of sufferings, failures, disappointments.
It has been a normal life. But it has given me a faith
to that big vision that all the people in the world can hear an evangelism.
We work so that nobody be left without God's grace.
This fall will be 50 years when I wrote my name
in the book of an academic voluntary mission.
This alliance was founded 1899. I was a member 247.
All those who commit themselves to give
their lives in the work of the Lord in mission field can write their names.
For me this was a serious commitment;
I want everybody to hear the evangelism.
I have lived my life this way.
Another word besides a radical comes to my mind when I think about you.
That is enduring, you are an enduring Christian.
I'll read from James1: 2-3 ;
” Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kind,
because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance.”
What do you think about this Bible verse?
It is true. God allows sufferings.
God believes that sufferings can produce something in us.
Suffering is showing God's trust towards us.
It is a part of our growth.
So a mere sunshine without clouds can't produce a paradise but a desert.
We need storms that we become what God wants us to be.
We are some kind of diamonds.
When somebody finds us we are not a shining jewelery
but some kind of stone block.
Then there is a plan; pieces will be cut,
will be smoothed long time on the working table.
If a diamond would have feelings
it would scream when it's been smoothed and cut
because that is suffering.
But as a result there is a shining jewelery.
We are also at the school of God where suffering is used as God's tool.
A Lois has said:” In a blessing God is whispering to us,
but in His Word He is speaking to us,
in sufferings He is screaming to us.
Sometimes we need screaming because
we don't hear small communication.”
During a last decade you have had lots of sufferings.
Your wife got a cancer and later passed away.
You became ill with cancer. you had a bypass operation.
How all this has impacted you?
It will leave a mark.
Perhaps the most difficult was my wife becoming ill and her death.
It was a 4 year struggle.
I could say I would not give up those years.
We grew together in a new way.
The last 7 weeks we stayed in the same hospital room.
From morning till night we were together.
It was actually keeping the promise I did 38 years ago
to love her till death do us apart.
Something in me grew to adult stage.
My own sickness were smaller;
a cancer, a heart infarct and my other heart problem.
This is a part of life.
Everybody is going to suffer.
What have these sufferings done in your life?
You talked about diamonds.
They have taken defiance away.
I have needed to accept that I am not the saver of the whole world.
I do have my own boundaries.
I am just a little helpless human being.
When I am sick it hurts. I am not a hero.
I am not so important and good, only My Lord is.
There is nothing what is valuable.
Christ is the only one what is left in my hand.
Difficulties have always an effect on God?
But God have also an effect on difficulties.
This is a very important interaction.
A suffering is not necessarily a blessing.
Nobody wants to suffer. Nobody plans to suffer.
A suffering chooses us.
In that suffering it will bring up in us what we are.
Is it something that makes us bitter and curse or
something that melts us or takes off all the outer layers and
leaves what is essential.
Can radicals grow in sufferings?
Yes and no. There are people who were
born as radicals and they go through sufferings.
Radicals hit their heads to tree. It is a part of their nature.
There are people who take life so seriously,
everything in black and white.
They do not agree with compromises.
That type of people get into conflicts although
it is not a part of their nature.
But their have radical thoughts and they produce conflicts.
Because we fight against large majority where change is negative.
People don't change until the pain of unchanged is bigger than
the pain of the change.
Most people don't recognize the pain of unchanged and
they consider radicals as troublemakers
Have you experienced opposition against change in your older days?
Yes many times I have met a young person who is so enthusiastic.
Then I think let him be but then God speaks and says ;
”Open up your ears and listen what he says.”
It is great that there are these young radicals.
When your life is in God's hands what kind of adventures you encounter?
There is no certain pattern for everybody.
All of us have a different road.
I have been able to preach over 50 different countries.
I have been staying in very primitive circumstances.
I have been preaching when
somebody had pointed a gun to my head.
You remember that moment. I have had inner turmoil.
For me it's been an adventure.
I don't have a permanent position
like a priest have repeatedly same events.
I have needed to go in front of new people and new crowds
My workplace is more in the streets than in churches.
I could be in sports arena and stadiums.
I feel that when churches would more break out from their bunkers
out from buildings to preach the gospel.
Every Cristian would experience more adventures.
As long as we sit down and don't do anything;
that is not an adventure.
What is the reason that so many people are just sitting on their pew?
It comes from teachings and experiences.
We live according a liturgic.
This is the way it was at the beginning
it will be like this always and forever.
Nothing is going to change.
When they try to do something new at the church, answer is;
do it as long as nothing will change.
People have lost hope.
There is disappointments because they are only objects.
They are not fully authorized Christians whose task as
a representative of Christ in workplaces, at home and
in hobby places has not been valued.
Here we need a revolution.
Have you felt your spiritual life to be flat dry dull without meaning?
Oh many times. I could tell 2 occasions.
When I realized how I could be filled with the Holy Spirit.
After receiving that my Christian life became flat and flatter.
I was thinking what is the reason for this?
Then I was reading Colossians 3 and Ephesians 5
alongside each other.
There is the same theme but one difference.
They have been written close to each other
They both have the same themes
Ephesians 5 says “Let the Spirit fill you”
Colossians 3 says”let the Word of Christ richly live in you”
God's word and the Holy Spirit walk hand in hand.
I realized that I was so busy that
I didn't have time to concentrate the Word of God.
The Word is the sword of the Spirit.
I had only used the Holy Spirit with bare hands and
left Him to do the work without the tool.
I had not fed myself with the Word of God.
This opened a discovery trip for me.
The second happened not so long ago.
I have taught how to tell evangelism in the streets.
But for a long time I didn't do it myself.
I preached in meetings for large crowds but
I couldn't get myself going to walk in streets to talk individually.
Just during a couple years
I noticed this is missing from my life.
The joy disappeared I got withdrawn
the fear of people took over.
Now when I am back at the streets
talking to one or two about Jesus. It is an adventure.
Every Christian could do this.
Thank you Kalevi Lehtinen.
We have to end now but we will meet next week.
So next week we will have our last meeting.
We will talk about Europa. Europa, where are you going?
Bye Bye
Subtitles: Marjatta Suurnäkki